Episode 148

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Published on:

3rd Mar 2022

Episode #148 - What's Next For Roman Abramovich and Chelsea feat. Goalitics' Oli Carpenter

In Episode #148 of the Squeaky Bum Time Podcast, Mike is joined by Goalitics founder Oli Carpenter to break down the ever-evolving situation for embattled Chelsea owner Roman Abramovich as he now looks set to reliquinsh control of his beloved football club.

  • First of all, how did we get here and what of Abramovich's rumored ties to Vladimir Putin?
  • Who are some potential new ownership groups and are we looking at a potential Stan Kroenke situation at Stamford Bridge?
  • What could new ownership mean for Chelsea's current operating staff? Who stays and who goes? What fates await Marina Granovskaia, Paulo Ferreira and Thomas Tuchel?
  • Will this negatively affect Chelsea's on-field performance in the top four race and Champions League?

Follow us on Twitter (@SqueakyBum_Pod), Instagram (@SqueakyBumTimePod) and Facebook (Squeaky Bum Time Podcast) to stay up to date!

Part of the Chop Sports Media Network!

Transcript

00:01

hello and welcome to the squeaky bum

00:03

time podcast with mike and laurent

00:05

laurent isn't here this week but we've

00:06

got somebody better it is friday march

00:08

4th in this episode chelsea fans strap

00:11

in it's been a wild week of drama on the

00:14

field with cup craziness and nonsense

00:16

carabao cup fa cup and of course off the

00:19

field with all of the

00:21

wildly evolving roman abramovich saga

00:24

speaking of we've got a guest on to help

00:26

us get to the bottom of all of that

00:27

we're happy to welcome to the show ollie

00:29

carpenter of goal lytics

00:31

ali how are you today

00:33

hi i'm good thank you mike it's it's

00:36

good to be here and i'm looking forward

00:38

to talking shop with you today yeah

00:39

absolutely so again thank you so much

00:41

for coming on um first let's talk a

00:43

little bit about you and what goal

00:44

lytics is uh we met on twitter uh over

00:47

the course of the last week or so um but

00:49

i know i have some questions because it

00:51

seems like a really interesting project

00:52

so i'll kind of shut up and let you take

00:54

the floor

00:55

um well goaltex is something i sort of

00:57

set up kind of ad hoc um out of nowhere

01:01

what originally happened was i i posted

01:03

a great big long thread about roman

01:05

abramovich and his ties to uh the

01:08

kremlin and putin and things like that

01:09

and it blew up it got like 3 000

01:12

retweets in a couple days like over 10

01:14

000 likes three million of people have

01:16

seen it and i wasn't expecting the uh

01:18

the absolutely huge response that came

01:20

from it so um i thought well what if

01:22

there's a dedicated place for this sort

01:23

of thing

01:24

um so i set up at golatix which is uh

01:27

basically your one-stop shop for

01:29

everything uh which is sport and

01:31

politics related

01:33

very cool very cool it's a better name

01:34

than squeaky bum time we should have

01:35

come up with that

01:37

so that's awesome and i'm i'm looking

01:39

forward to kind of watching not just the

01:41

the growth of of the platform but also

01:44

understanding a little bit more

01:45

obviously um on our show we sort of live

01:48

in that gray area i think that that's

01:50

one where some of the more interesting

01:51

story lines are for me as a spur

01:53

supporter it's why won't joel lewis

01:55

spend a dime with no money but

01:58

largely uh it's in it's in larger things

02:00

like this right and uh and it's not

02:02

often that it happens um but when

02:04

something

02:05

as as massive as the roman abramovich

02:08

saga that we've seen kind of pour out

02:10

over the last week or so it's great to

02:12

have someone like yourself on the show

02:14

to talk about so um so yeah i mean we

02:16

chatted i think it was on saturday or

02:19

maybe sunday uh because right because it

02:21

was during the the the league cup final

02:23

or before it um and so saturday right

02:26

let's walk through the whole week and

02:27

then we'll kind of go step by step

02:28

because i'm curious what your thoughts

02:29

about it pretty much the whole way

02:30

through um so saturday he announces that

02:34

he's going to be stepping away from the

02:36

club but he's still going to be the

02:37

owner but he's giving control of the uh

02:40

to the board of trustees

02:41

and so everybody went hmm that doesn't

02:44

sound like the end of this road but okay

02:46

what does that mean for marina what does

02:48

that mean for a couple of the other

02:49

higher-ups of chelsea right uh sunday

02:51

obviously tumultuous day in the league

02:53

cup with the whole kappa saga we talked

02:55

about that in our last episode we won't

02:56

make you re-lift that um

02:58

[Music]

03:00

uh monday

03:01

all of a sudden abramovic pops up uh

03:04

helping in peace talks between the

03:06

ukraine and russia

03:07

where in the hell did that come from

03:10

tuesday matt law of i think the daily

03:13

mail uh reported that ibrahimovic will

03:15

be receiving offers and possibly could

03:18

sell that turns into wednesday yeah he's

03:21

selling he makes an official statement

03:23

uh with uh through chelsea football club

03:25

on their social media outlets on their

03:26

website all that says he does not want

03:28

the loan to be repaid back

03:30

but the price tag

03:32

suggests otherwise and then of course on

03:34

thursday uh chelsea were actually

03:36

included i don't know if you saw this in

03:37

what was rumored to be the super league

03:40

2 electric boogaloo as i'm calling it

03:42

but there were no german clubs no psg or

03:44

spurs or arsenal i think there was

03:46

actually there's conflicting reports on

03:47

that um

03:49

so i mean and there could be some some

03:52

news since i don't know since we woke up

03:54

today uh that is even furthering this

03:57

this story so but let's start back with

03:59

that that thread on twitter if you could

04:02

uh i guess as i was saying to our

04:04

listeners in the last episode we're

04:06

gonna have ollie come on and explain it

04:07

to me like i'm five years old so without

04:10

further ado

04:11

um well the so the the threads kind of

04:14

breaks down uh what uh abramovich's

04:18

relationship with putin and the kremlin

04:20

has been and it's a story of about two

04:21

decades in the making

04:24

um and it sort of it points out some

04:26

sort of certain factors um of about

04:28

where abramovic and putin have crossed

04:31

paths um in the past um specifically

04:34

like mostly in like the early:

04:37

um

04:38

putin was um

04:40

recommended to

04:42

uh boris yeltsin by abramovic as his

04:45

successor to russia for example um

04:48

abramovic was uh a governor of um a

04:51

russian oblast like a province called

04:53

the chukotka in the far east for like

04:55

eight years um

04:57

he even recommended uh president

04:59

medvedev um to be

05:01

uh to jump in as as president when

05:04

putin's

05:05

previous term had subsided um while he

05:08

sort of took a years stint away

05:11

as a prime minister

05:13

yeah it's very sort of liberal uh how

05:15

all that went but um

05:17

and uh the other major factor was uh

05:20

abramovich obviously had a very large

05:22

role to play in

05:24

um russia's successful world cup bid uh

05:26

for the:

05:29

um

05:30

from what i have read he has been

05:32

instrumental

05:33

in that um but it's interesting that

05:35

re from the year sort of like:

05:37

to:

05:39

involvement with the kremlin and then

05:41

after that there's almost nothing

05:44

um

05:46

except for the russian world cup um

05:48

which leads me personally to believe

05:50

that abramovic sort of since that point

05:53

since leaving his governorship in

05:54

chicago um

05:56

kind of wanted to distance himself from

05:58

putin in a sense um

06:01

and you can see why he would want to do

06:03

that in some ways you know especially

06:05

for the reasons we're seeing now you

06:06

know sanctions and things like that that

06:08

are being uh talked around you know

06:11

everyone on twitter becomes an expert

06:12

overnight right but um on the on

06:15

geopolitics last week it was uh

06:17

something else this week is geopolitics

06:20

it's really interesting

06:22

um and it's also important to note that

06:24

um abramovic as well

06:26

um like i say he was really involved in

06:29

the:

06:31

russian world cup bid

06:33

but other than that in like a decade he

06:35

hasn't really been involved with the uh

06:37

with the kremlin at all um so there's

06:40

this sort of

06:42

easy isn't he

06:43

involved sort of thing to it where

06:46

it seems that like he's sort of he's

06:48

keeping putin at arm's length through

06:49

other things that he's done such as he

06:51

gave putin a yacht for example um he

06:54

also um didn't go back to russia though

06:57

when he when his visa wasn't renewed in

06:59

the uk he went to israel instead and got

07:02

israeli citizenship from their right to

07:03

return

07:04

um and it just shows that this whole

07:07

thing is that abramovich

07:09

knows putin like that's completely you

07:12

know that that's beyond

07:13

a doubt known at this point um knows

07:16

putin and even was described at least in

07:18

the past to sort of having like a

07:19

father-son relationship with him um but

07:22

now i think that's kind of

07:23

more evolved into like uneasy

07:26

alliance or sort of like

07:28

as

07:30

that's kind of what i'd say whereas you

07:31

know he's kind of keeping putin at arm's

07:33

length

07:34

um while sort of trying to protect his

07:36

own assets and i think that's kind of

07:38

ultimately where this whole sale of

07:39

chelsea's come from

07:41

that makes sense and even if you go back

07:43

to um the the world cup bid right i

07:46

don't remember exactly when but i know

07:48

the:

07:51

around:

07:54

that whole process was so if you really

07:56

if you parse it back four more years

07:57

:

08:00

all settled so that settles right into

08:02

that oh

08:03

to:

08:06

spelled out for us yeah and the

08:08

important thing to remember as well is

08:09

like a brown which is like a notoriously

08:11

private guy so like he didn't speak to

08:13

the media for like 16 years or something

08:15

like that before eventually coming out

08:17

and having an interview one day um and

08:19

it just shows that maybe you know part

08:21

of the whole reason of him wanting to

08:23

sell is that there are just too many

08:25

eyes on him at the moment you know he's

08:26

a private guy and he doesn't want to be

08:28

in the spotlight anymore and maybe

08:30

that's kind of been the the reason for

08:32

him choosing to want to accept offers

08:34

for chelsea

08:35

sure and you know that was obviously one

08:37

of the questions i i think everybody has

08:39

right where um

08:41

it doesn't seem

08:43

because he is a private guy you don't

08:44

get a good insight into who the man is

08:47

what the man make what makes the man

08:48

tick

08:49

and

08:50

i think you could draw a straight line

08:52

between him and chelsea football club as

08:54

far as like this is he loves this more

08:56

than any person on earth it feels like

08:58

right and so there were um

09:01

at least murmurs of a complete redesign

09:04

or potential new stadium to replace the

09:06

bridge at some point right so so he was

09:09

going to make his mark on

09:11

um

09:12

an everlasting mark as if he hadn't

09:14

already right um on on chelsea um so it

09:18

is it is sort of interesting to see that

09:21

the the rapidness with which this is

09:23

sort of uh kind of played out between

09:26

like i gave the timeline before between

09:28

sunday and wednesday it went from um

09:30

maybe he's gonna step back for a little

09:32

while too he's selling the club he has

09:34

three offers on the table it's it's

09:36

impressively fast um

09:38

so so that's kind of where i it's all

09:41

conjecture right but i like you said it

09:43

is certainly to do with the most recent

09:46

fallout in uh in in russia and ukraine

09:49

so um

09:51

i want to turn to a second to um what do

09:54

you think about

09:56

the future for chelsea potentially looks

09:58

like

09:59

in the in life after roman if you will

10:02

um we've heard that there are a couple

10:04

of buyers there's some u.s consortiums

10:07

um

10:08

and i i look at it in the context of

10:11

current premier league ownerships right

10:13

um

10:14

and three that i would bring up two are

10:16

in london uh with stan kroenke uh joe

10:19

lewis who are

10:21

i would say relatively hands off and

10:23

then sheik mansour obviously of

10:24

manchester city um who's far more not

10:28

that he's active but he his his funding

10:30

is active for and i'll stay take a step

10:32

back for the listeners who don't i'm not

10:33

sure

10:35

um all of this money that chelsea has

10:37

spent on players we've talked about how

10:39

much they've spent on lukaku quite a bit

10:41

um this is all in the context of

10:44

personal loans from roman abramovich

10:47

that correct me if i'm wrong uh is

10:49

upwards of 1.5 billion pounds maybe two

10:53

i'm not sure that i lose it in exchange

10:54

rates sometimes um

10:56

where effectively

10:58

when he sells

11:00

the thinking is that that would be built

11:02

into the cost of the acquisition for the

11:05

new buyer so with that in mind

11:08

do you think that there's um

11:12

does you think that that a deters any

11:14

potential buyers and b

11:16

do you think that what what do you think

11:18

of the new potential ownership that

11:19

could come in

11:20

in the context of like i said that

11:22

cronky lewis and mansour

11:25

spectrum if you will

11:27

uh okay so i'll do do one thing at a

11:29

time

11:30

the um

11:31

in terms of the

11:33

the the 1.5 billion pound loan um it

11:36

appears that he's at uh abramovich he

11:38

released in his statement when he said

11:40

he was going to sell the club that he

11:41

wasn't going to be asking for that back

11:43

um

11:44

and that uh therefore chelsea will be

11:47

able to

11:48

just sort of

11:49

have it written off as it were um

11:52

brahmovich and so abramovic is only

11:54

looking to uh i believe he said he's

11:56

only looking to get the net proceeds um

11:59

and he's going to donate the rest to

12:01

charities in ukraine um you know sorry

12:04

he's actually going to set up a charity

12:06

to donate to the ukrainian people who

12:08

are suffering at the moment um and i

12:10

think more than anything that can

12:11

probably tell you where he stands on

12:13

things um without him having to actually

12:16

um

12:17

condemn putin himself because we all

12:19

know what happens when people condemn

12:20

putin

12:22

people don't last very long so um

12:26

in terms of um the loan itself i don't

12:28

think um that'll put people off because

12:30

like i said um

12:31

abramovic is planning on having it sort

12:33

of be written off as it were um and he's

12:35

not asking chelsea for it back there was

12:37

a lot of conjecture around and a lot of

12:40

speculation around what would happen if

12:42

someone wanted to come in and they

12:44

assume that debt and then suddenly

12:46

chelsea are a team that's one and a half

12:48

billion pounds in debt and the owners

12:49

don't really want to do anything

12:51

with it

12:52

they just kind of want to use it to

12:53

profit off chelsea and make some money

12:55

which would be the worst case scenario

12:58

um but i would say in terms of like what

13:01

a new ownership structure needs to look

13:03

like

13:04

for chelsea there's there's definitely

13:06

the chance of getting sort of like a

13:08

consortium type um set up with multiple

13:11

buyers that's what's being talked about

13:12

a lot today um i believe his name is

13:15

weiss or vice i don't know how you

13:16

pronounce it but the swedish guy and

13:18

some americans are looking into buying

13:20

uh at least they've put an offer on the

13:22

table i think of around three billion

13:24

for abramovich

13:26

and we're hearing of other reports of um

13:31

unconfirmed people you know people we

13:34

don't know yet unnamed um who are also

13:36

bidding

13:37

literally as of sort of a couple hours

13:40

ago um for chelsea so

13:43

i think where where it could go um in

13:46

terms of chelsea the the post-roman era

13:48

is going to be for starters extremely

13:52

like it could be a hugely broad

13:56

set of circumstances on the one hand you

13:59

could get

14:00

roman 2 right which pretty much every

14:03

chelsea family to use best case scenario

14:05

um in my opinion you get someone who

14:08

loves the club who wants to put money

14:10

into the club um keeps that ruthlessness

14:13

that chelsea are so well known for

14:15

um and win at all costs because that's

14:17

the that's sort of the uh the chelsea

14:20

um sort of culture as it were you know

14:22

i think a lot of chelsea fans when they

14:25

look at

14:25

um other teams like um arsenal for

14:28

example or man united they really worry

14:30

in terms of like the the ownership

14:32

structure and if we don't get a good

14:34

owner on the other end of that spectrum

14:35

if we get an owner who is somewhere more

14:38

like the glazers or someone more like

14:39

cronky i don't know much about joel joe

14:41

lewis myself but maybe he is a part of

14:44

that

14:47

you know maybe it's the case that

14:50

he's you know like maybe in from that

14:52

way you're looking at people who are

14:53

trying to make money off of the club

14:55

instead of really um put the you know

14:57

who are putting the money before the

14:58

club and the and the money before the

15:00

passion for the sport and the club which

15:02

is

15:03

and and that won't sit very well with

15:05

chelsea fans because that'll be a

15:06

massive culture shock to someone who's

15:09

who's treated the club like his baby put

15:11

ridiculous amounts of money into it

15:13

loves the city loves the people and and

15:16

now that he's selling you even though

15:18

i think he knows the writings on the

15:19

wall which is why he's selling i think

15:21

he knows that he will be sanctioned soon

15:22

if he doesn't um

15:24

so ideally what i have heard and this is

15:28

all conjecture and twitter nonsense you

15:31

know if you choose it to be i suppose

15:32

but um from what he has said he wants

15:35

obviously to the best for chelsea so

15:37

he'll likely pick the best candidate who

15:40

gives him a

15:41

strong enough bid so if there are

15:42

several uh buyers all looking for a

15:45

roughly about the three billion mark i

15:47

think he'll probably end up um

15:50

choosing whichever one of those is best

15:52

for chelsea

15:54

which is a little bit worrisome in some

15:57

cases because

15:58

um roman loves the club and we know that

16:00

but we don't know um well we probably do

16:03

know how much he likes the british

16:05

government at the moment which is

16:06

probably not a lot um and you might want

16:08

to give them some problems or you know

16:10

something like that or

16:11

hurt the british government in some way

16:13

through chelsea by his choice of next

16:15

owner but personally i don't think i

16:17

think it'd be a little vindictive of him

16:18

to do that i think he loves the club too

16:20

much for that and he'd rather go with

16:22

grace

16:23

um so i think ultimately

16:25

yeah like it's gonna be

16:27

one thing or it's gonna be completely on

16:29

the other end and it it's it's sort of

16:31

it's uh it's like being at the crest of

16:33

a roller coaster for chelsea fans at the

16:35

moment you have no like you know you

16:37

know there's a you know it's about to

16:39

get really exciting uh

16:41

uh for one reason or another but we're

16:43

just not sure in what way yet well it

16:45

seems like it's been exciting the last i

16:47

don't know what 10 days or so uh

16:49

substituting goalkeepers before

16:51

penalties i promised i wouldn't talk

16:53

about it i'm sorry

16:55

that's okay but to be honest i think it

16:56

was the right decision i think it's the

16:58

right call

16:59

okay

17:00

and so wait so i'm actually now now i

17:02

have to why do you think that was the

17:04

right call well okay right so

17:07

just to get into that you know this is a

17:09

good opportunity for me to speak about

17:10

my my uh because we all know

17:12

from my thread and things like that

17:14

clearly of my excellent political

17:16

insight

17:17

but here we can talk about my insane

17:19

ball knowledge which is you know it's

17:20

great

17:23

and you know and how modest i am as well

17:25

yes um

17:27

but

17:27

so here's what i think is the right

17:29

decision uh for him to bring kepper on

17:31

yes mandy was having a good game right

17:33

that's in the in the in the league cup

17:35

final there was no doubt about that

17:37

but the plan has always been for kepper

17:39

to come on that is always the plan in

17:41

penalty shootouts kepper is a penalty

17:43

specialist

17:44

and i think he doesn't get anywhere near

17:46

the amount of bat well he gets way more

17:48

backlash than he would have done because

17:50

he missed

17:51

um i think if he had come on say

17:55

uh the

17:56

instead of going to 11 10 or whatever it

17:59

was kepper scores his penalty and it

18:01

just goes on further right and then

18:02

eventually say liverpool win anyway on

18:04

say 15 14 or whatever um then that

18:07

player gets a lot of stick but on top of

18:09

keffer being sobbed on he also missed

18:12

the the penalty you know even when he's

18:14

named as the the specific penalty spent

18:17

specialist but

18:18

i think you've got to trust in tucle on

18:20

that one um you know he's uh kepp has

18:22

saved us in a fair few penalty uh

18:24

shootouts in the past in particular the

18:26

super cup people have really short

18:27

memories you know he came on

18:29

in the 119th minute of that game won us

18:32

the penalty shootout you know so i think

18:34

it was it was for all intents and

18:36

purposes especially when you look at

18:38

stats and the statistics and the um the

18:40

percentages and things like that of

18:41

penalty saves keppa is a better penalty

18:44

saver than mendy no matter how good a

18:45

game he's having right and and

18:47

ultimately i

18:48

um you can't put

18:50

too much pressure on a goalkeeper

18:52

missing a penalty because that's not

18:54

their job um you know you can say all

18:56

you like about having missed the other

18:58

penalty uh having not saved the other

19:00

penalties but remember kelleher didn't

19:01

save any others either right no and and

19:03

so

19:04

when we say penalty specialist we did

19:06

not mean taking penalties right

19:09

i think that's important to call out

19:10

right away we call that we talked a lot

19:12

about it on our show on on tuesday um

19:15

the thing that we found interesting and

19:18

i was actually saying and i was first

19:20

guessing it i i had forgotten that they

19:23

do do this and i did listen to uh tukel

19:25

saying you know the plan assuming we

19:27

have a substitution left is to bring him

19:29

on at the end of extra time and i

19:31

understand that uh two things i'm not

19:33

sure there's there's enough data in

19:36

games to say he's definitely better than

19:39

in penalties which is by the way still a

19:41

handful of coin flips anyway most of the

19:43

time right um so that he was having a

19:46

good game and also he's five inches

19:48

bigger than kevin

19:50

which i think should matter more than it

19:52

does right like so um as a casual

19:54

observer frankly i don't care much for

19:56

chelsea or liverpool i was watching that

19:58

game uh kind of as a very interested

20:01

neutral i guess um

20:03

but uh i i found that to be very very

20:06

interesting and of course you have to

20:08

talk about keppe's past right with the

20:09

the it was the lead cup i think a few

20:11

years back with sorry right so so that

20:14

that is for me at least and i think for

20:16

a lot of fans the lasting image they

20:18

have of keppa because that was sort of

20:19

the peak of him at chelsea uh if there

20:22

was one i suppose um

20:24

but yeah so i think that that was the

20:26

the main

20:27

questions that we sort of had walking

20:29

out of walking into the penalty shootout

20:31

i was like i don't know and then i don't

20:32

know if you're familiar with um the men

20:34

and blazers podcast they're very famous

20:36

here in the states they are both british

20:37

by the way one and then uh michael

20:39

davies is a chelsea supporter um but

20:41

they always say the premier league

20:43

scriptwriters right like because it's

20:44

like some things you just can't make up

20:46

right keppa comes on and it's 10 10 or

20:49

11 10 at this point and he has to he has

20:51

to score to keep it going and of course

20:53

he hits it not even not even on the

20:56

frame he hits it into rosie right so i

20:57

mean it was an excellent field goal it

20:59

was fantastic yeah i mean that's good

21:02

from 60 yards so yeah um yeah i mean um

21:06

so i guess i'll i'll i'll move into more

21:08

football then com questions then do you

21:11

think that because we saw them struggle

21:13

with loot in town yes yesterday whenever

21:15

that was in the fa cup they ended up

21:17

pulling out a 3-2 victory um do you

21:20

think that this and tuko has

21:22

acknowledged this do you think that this

21:24

kind of can create issues for chelsea on

21:26

the field in the next i don't know

21:29

next couple of weeks they seem to be

21:31

locked into that third spot

21:33

we've said on the show a lot we don't

21:34

really think that they're of the elk of

21:36

liverpool or city this year and that's

21:38

certainly nothing against chelsea at all

21:40

um and they don't seem to be in danger

21:44

of any of the frankly also rans behind

21:46

them fighting amongst themselves for

21:47

fourth but do you think that they could

21:49

be pulled into that race as a function

21:51

of this

21:54

i

21:55

it's possible uh you know i think

21:56

there's a lot of um the speculation

21:58

around the club right now and um i think

22:01

there's a there's a really interesting

22:02

way to view it and that's through two

22:05

cool's managerial style um it's really

22:08

important to remember to said like

22:09

several times this season when there's

22:11

been like drama around the club whether

22:13

it was the romelu lukaku interview um

22:16

whether it's now the stuff with ukraine

22:17

or abramovich selling the club he hates

22:20

noise you know he's someone who doesn't

22:22

like distractions

22:24

and it's clear like you know seeing the

22:26

um the players play yesterday even

22:28

though we did pull out the victory um we

22:29

were nowhere near the sort of quality

22:32

that you would expect um from you know a

22:34

chelsea side going up against a good and

22:37

strong but ultimately less good luton

22:40

loon town team

22:42

um so i think it's clear to see that the

22:44

players are distracted um it's now come

22:46

out i think angola kante did a uh

22:48

an interview today where he said um

22:50

because the news came out so

22:53

soon before the game it sort of it did

22:55

have a sort of a distracting effect on

22:58

the players

22:59

and it will also have that effect on

23:00

touhou

23:01

you know

23:03

i'm not sure what uh what possessed him

23:06

to choose to play loftus-cheek uh in the

23:08

center of a back three defense but you

23:10

know it's it's again it's you know it's

23:12

one of those ones like the uh the kepper

23:14

and mendy situation if it if it works

23:16

it's a it's a stroke of genius

23:19

and it did work um so i think it's fair

23:21

to say that there's there's a lot going

23:23

on at chelsea at the moment and um

23:26

i would be surprised if we didn't see

23:27

results suffer on the pitch a little

23:30

as a result um but i guess now it's the

23:32

chelsea fan in me saying i really hope

23:34

that doesn't happen because getting

23:36

pulled into the top four race will be

23:38

quite um quite a miserable place to be

23:41

uh

23:42

um you know especially because it's so

23:43

competitive this year for that fourth

23:45

spot you've got the likes of spurs are

23:47

looking better under conde conte all the

23:49

time you know even though you know

23:51

they've had their issues you've got

23:52

arsenal who are who are just flying in

23:54

some games you've got west ham man

23:56

united who are probably actually in my

23:59

opinion won't make it this season but um

24:01

you know you've got a lot of really

24:03

really strong teams vying for fourth and

24:05

if chelsea let up too much they can

24:07

definitely get leapfrogged um and with

24:09

the distractions going on at the club um

24:12

i think that's definitely has to be a

24:13

valid concern whether or not it will be

24:15

in a few weeks you know we'll see maybe

24:16

they can steady the ship

24:18

yeah no and as i turn to looking at

24:20

chelsea's upcoming schedule hey burnley

24:23

is not your father's burnley anymore i

24:25

mean they are

24:26

they are still playing a lot of the same

24:28

style they are still very much sean

24:30

dyche ball if you will but there's

24:32

there's a hunger about them uh that i

24:36

i'm scared of now i mean i just got bit

24:38

by it a few weeks ago right or whatever

24:39

that was but so they go into turf more

24:41

on saturday then they they uh are away

24:44

at norwich look that's luton town right

24:47

like you can be distracted as you want

24:48

you're still a chelsea football club you

24:50

still should take care of business

24:51

against norwich newcastle for me at home

24:54

i think that that's one that they can

24:55

probably take care of then you've got

24:57

some of the cup games you're already up

24:59

nil um against lille in the uh in the

25:01

champions league we've seen more

25:03

dramatic things happen

25:05

but come on

25:06

unlikely right so uh and then

25:08

middlesbrough uh in the fa cup the less

25:11

talked about middlesbrough's last fa cup

25:13

game the better um and uh uh

25:16

then brentford and southampton in leeds

25:18

right so obviously after that it

25:20

certainly picks up you've got far more

25:23

you know difficult fixtures to end the

25:25

season um but i do think that you pick

25:28

up a good amount a healthy amount of

25:29

points there

25:30

and you probably move into the uh the

25:32

quarterfinal the champions league and

25:33

probably the semi-final of the fa cup so

25:36

you're looking at you know uh a season

25:38

despite all of the lukaku stuff despite

25:41

all of the you know the the ownership

25:43

stuff you were quite literally one

25:45

penalty away from the carabao cup

25:47

whatever

25:49

more than likely the at least the

25:51

quarterfinals of the champions league

25:52

the semi-finals of the fa cup and

25:54

comfortably in the top four because

25:55

again

25:56

i just it's it's going to be awfully

25:58

hard for me to see them lose that many

26:00

points in the next call it three to four

26:02

weeks

26:03

where spurs or united or west ham or

26:07

arsenal basically two of those has to

26:10

catch you for it to really be

26:11

troublesome and yeah we've talked a lot

26:14

on the show we've spent way too much

26:15

time on the top four race this year

26:16

because it's one of those hot potatoes

26:18

that literally nobody wants uh and

26:20

sometimes that makes for the best races

26:23

but not when you're in it i can promise

26:24

you that

26:26

so

26:27

it's really interesting because you know

26:29

that like i said it's really really

26:31

competitive this season especially for

26:33

that um you know it seems that the i

26:35

mean for all intents and purposes i know

26:36

there's been talk about like sort of

26:38

like a title check

26:40

reignition for liverpool but i don't

26:41

think that'll happen i think i think

26:43

city have it's sewn up um i think

26:45

liverpool comfortably get second

26:47

then you've got chelsea who you know

26:49

despite what we've said it's pretty

26:50

likely they'll get third but fourth

26:52

position is absolutely crucial this

26:54

season um you know it and the clubs

26:58

vying for it are all they're all big

26:59

clubs they're all clubs that really you

27:01

know are looking

27:02

um looking to make their mark especially

27:05

the likes of west ham who who are

27:07

absolutely phenomenal on the david moyes

27:09

this season you know for what they've

27:10

been doing in the past

27:12

um he said yeah like uh there's a

27:14

there's a it's a getting very

27:16

competitive just going back um to

27:18

talking about chelsea's schedule um yeah

27:20

burnley aren't your father's burnley

27:21

anymore i think that's a really good way

27:23

to put it they've um they've sort of

27:25

evolved with the times they i think it

27:27

used to kind of be the um ever since

27:30

stoke left the premier league burnley

27:32

sort of took up the mantle of being that

27:34

team

27:35

um you know where it's just kind of

27:38

kick it lump it long and you know you'll

27:40

get enough points and you'll stay up but

27:42

you know um maxwell corney is one of my

27:44

favorite players um out of the top six

27:46

this season he's he's an absolutely

27:49

phenomenal player um and he's been

27:51

phenomenal for for burnley this season

27:54

so i'm really really impressed with him

27:55

so

27:56

i don't know if he is injured or

27:58

anything at the moment but if he plays

28:00

against chelsea um that will be a

28:02

serious concern for us because you know

28:05

all

28:06

you know

28:08

we have this thing amongst um chelsea

28:10

fans sometimes we're called charity fc

28:12

because we're we're good at just gifting

28:14

games away

28:16

and uh and you know i'm sure as the

28:18

spurs fan sometimes it feels like that i

28:20

have no idea what you're talking about

28:24

so you know it's kind of a chance for

28:25

charity fc to be in full effect

28:27

especially against the likes of burnley

28:29

um and you know i know how you say that

28:31

norwich aren't really uh you know aren't

28:33

really much competition and while we did

28:34

beat them by quite a significant margin

28:36

in the earlier game this season chelsea

28:38

were flying high they had a lot of the

28:40

players they um

28:41

don't now don't have a lot of the

28:43

players that they had back then because

28:44

of the likes of chillwell getting

28:45

injured and things like that and

28:48

as well when you look at it norwich is

28:49

starting to press up on form as well

28:51

they almost drew with liverpool a couple

28:53

weeks ago i think you know so i think

28:54

it's it's important to remember that

28:56

norwich were also on an opera trajectory

28:58

that i don't think

28:59

you know it's the classic thing of the

29:00

premier league everyone can beat

29:02

everyone more or less except man city

29:04

man city beats everyone else but um

29:07

except for tottenham this year except

29:09

for tottenham

29:10

yeah who who then themselves can that's

29:13

our trouble against everyone else but

29:14

you know

29:16

uh yeah so it i don't know um i think

29:20

it will be a largely defined down to the

29:23

players response um especially with all

29:25

the uncertainty going on at the club at

29:27

the moment

29:28

um for whether the

29:30

where the chelsea's fixture list you

29:32

know weather comes for

29:34

april we're looking

29:35

like we've secured top uh we've secured

29:37

third place or whether it's looking a

29:39

little dicey you know it only takes one

29:41

or two poor results in tandem

29:44

before

29:45

especially at chelsea before people

29:46

start asking questions and

29:48

and there's like a lot of speculation

29:50

about what's next and what the answer is

29:52

especially with our misfiring attack

29:54

this season yeah now that makes sense

29:56

and they still have two games at hand as

29:58

i love to point out but those are not

30:00

easy games uh at home against leicester

30:02

and then you've got a london darby

30:04

against arsenal which i mean geez that

30:06

could be three versus four that could

30:07

have some kind of permutations for both

30:10

teams uh in the top four race so that'll

30:12

be a really exciting game still to be

30:13

decided when that game is going to be

30:16

um but yeah i think my larger point was

30:18

like hey

30:19

you're not playing a lot of the top side

30:21

these are points that despite charity fc

30:23

you probably should pick up and should

30:25

see you clear

30:27

through again a a bumbly uh top four

30:31

it's it's top three and then the rest i

30:33

think is how we've kind of um looked at

30:36

it for a lot of the season but um

30:38

so

30:39

let's go back to the post-roman era for

30:41

a second uh

30:43

i had again this is all twitter

30:45

conjecture i think is how you put it

30:47

it's absolutely bang on i have seen

30:49

names um like paula ferreira potentially

30:52

leaving the club uh marine i think that

30:54

was confirmed today is that confirmed

30:56

okay so then that's a that's a

30:57

significant loss

30:59

or absence

31:00

for chelsea going forward marina who we

31:02

have uh fawned over as much as any

31:04

tottenham can on this show the way that

31:07

she handles basically everything and you

31:09

could tell us better than than we the

31:11

homework that we did but

31:13

this is more or less her club at this

31:15

point is that fair to say

31:16

um yeah you could say that to a certain

31:19

degree um i think there's

31:22

marina gets uh a lot more credit

31:25

maybe than she should and also a lot

31:28

more stick than she should at the same

31:30

time so like she gets a lot of criticism

31:32

a lot of criticism and she also gets a

31:34

lot of love and the the love she gets is

31:36

obviously for being an excellent

31:38

financier of football deals right you

31:40

know the likes of selling the hazard for

31:42

whatever it was

31:44

combined 150 million on the last year of

31:46

his contract you've got morata who you

31:48

know i'm who i'm convinced at this point

31:50

is an international money laundering

31:52

operation because how

31:54

many people paid 60 odd million for

31:56

maratha um

31:58

you know and and getting good deals for

32:00

almost every player who we do bring in

32:02

um

32:03

you know it's uh marina who signed the

32:05

likes of uh con angola conte for 32

32:08

million where you know and if if you can

32:10

imagine the likes of angola kante going

32:13

for anything other than you know back

32:15

then going for anything other than

32:17

60 odd million now you'd be absolutely

32:20

laughing so

32:22

you know she's she gets a lot of praise

32:24

um

32:25

and she and she deserves that praise

32:27

it's worth saying you know i think um

32:29

what a clear thing is to see as well

32:31

about the speculation about who's coming

32:32

and who's leaving at chelsea to see how

32:34

good a person really is um because we

32:36

all get these little echo chambers of

32:37

our own clubs and our own fans right

32:40

is to actually look outside of it look

32:41

what and see what rival fans think of

32:44

someone joining or leaving your club

32:46

right and rival fans will be lapping up

32:48

the concept of mourinho leaving chelsea

32:50

that shows how big of an impact she's

32:52

had on the on the other side she gets

32:55

a lot more criticism than maybe um she

32:57

deserves especially from inside the

32:59

chelsea fan base because people don't

33:01

always quite understand and it's quite

33:03

easy to misunderstand why um because she

33:06

is only a financer of deals she doesn't

33:08

scout players she can only work with you

33:10

know okay this is the target all right

33:11

i'm going to negotiate the best price

33:13

that i can for this player um

33:16

she doesn't scout the players um so you

33:18

know the likes of lukaku and bakayoko

33:21

and this and that and and all the

33:23

players you know although now you know

33:25

the laundry list of players who have

33:27

started to not quite hit the right mark

33:29

at chelsea um she can be an easy

33:31

scapegoat because people go look she

33:33

paid for this but you know you're

33:34

actually going well the club paid for it

33:36

and she made the deal as good as it

33:38

could be but you know she's also you

33:40

know she's only given what's in front of

33:42

her in terms of targets at least that's

33:44

the way i understand it um and i think

33:47

people can um people can give mourinho a

33:50

lot of stick for that on the other side

33:52

as well there's valid criticisms to give

33:54

marina as well um because she is

33:57

notoriously hard-nosed right in terms of

33:59

business deals and that really works to

34:01

chelsea's um

34:03

to chelsea's benefit a lot of the time

34:05

but except when selling players that um

34:08

you know the when people talk about

34:09

deadwood players um you know these are

34:12

actually you know assets of the club and

34:14

it's important to be able to get as much

34:15

money out of them as possible for the

34:17

stable unsustainable running of the club

34:19

you've got the likes of you know

34:20

bakayoko uh bashuahi kennedy who just

34:24

came back into the squad all these sorts

34:26

of players who are still on chelsea

34:27

books danny drinkwater even you know who

34:29

he paid a ridiculous amount of money for

34:31

in his

34:32

oh just don't go into it but um

34:35

you know and and the reason marina gets

34:38

criticism is because at this point

34:40

chelsea are saying free up the wages

34:42

sell you know just sell them for

34:43

anything doesn't matter let their

34:45

contracts you know don't let the

34:46

contracts run just sell them for a

34:47

million sell them for a twix and a

34:49

packet of biscuits if you have to just

34:51

sell them um but marina uh is you know

34:54

focused on getting the most out that she

34:56

can for players you know if she can eat

34:58

seven for this player and three million

35:00

for this player and 20 million for this

35:02

player it adds up kind of quickly and i

35:03

think it's

35:05

it can be easy to miss that um but at

35:08

the same time it's very frustrating

35:09

where if she's going if she holds out um

35:12

on deals that potentially could make the

35:14

club better in the long run for the

35:15

financial

35:17

impact right now

35:19

so it's sort of it's here and there she

35:21

gets a lot more stick than she deserves

35:23

but she also gets a lot of love that i

35:25

think is also deserved but

35:28

you know she has her downsides as well

35:30

no that makes a lot of sense and i think

35:31

um

35:33

the uh the way that we look at her and i

35:35

think the way you said that like we

35:37

actually think she's fantastic so if she

35:39

did leave we'd be like all right that's

35:41

that's good news for not chelsea fans

35:43

essentially right um

35:45

uh i think the way that we look at her

35:47

is the way that she's managed what we

35:48

sort of refer to as like the chelsea

35:50

loan army and if laurent were here he

35:52

would be fawning over his new love child

35:54

conor gallagher um and so you look into

35:59

if let's say go back to the earlier part

36:01

of the conversation where like the worst

36:03

case scenario for

36:04

for chelsea where basically you have

36:06

more or less uh just a cranky as a

36:09

new owner right um uh you still have

36:13

that stable of you're gonna plug him

36:15

into your midfield next year no problem

36:16

right so um

36:18

there is even the worst case scenario

36:21

for chelsea in the near term

36:23

still pretty good right so um that's

36:26

sort of where we

36:28

have given her so much credit to say wow

36:30

not only is she moving these players on

36:33

to be able to fund a lukaku deal even if

36:35

that deal falls on its face it's a net

36:38

even right it doesn't hurt at all

36:39

whereas you know some of the other clubs

36:42

in the league especially

36:43

clubs that consider them

36:45

effectively fighting for the same spots

36:46

and same same trophies

36:48

spurs can't do that spurs literally

36:50

wanted to do that with lotaro martinez

36:51

and they couldn't right so um

36:54

so so it's interesting that even despite

36:56

all of roman's money in the loans and

36:58

all that stuff she does still to a

37:00

degree run it as you said like with the

37:02

hazard sale

37:04

pretty close to a net even uh you know

37:07

kind of operation which is shocking to

37:09

think about you think you only look at

37:10

it as oh they spent 100 million on the

37:12

concrete they spent this on this guy and

37:14

so on and so forth but actually like you

37:16

said 3 7 10 not just the dead wood but a

37:18

lot of these players coming through the

37:19

ranks they add up as well so um so i

37:23

find that that's how we've always at

37:24

least from from this side of the pond

37:26

myself and lauren have always looked at

37:28

uh marina as the man we got to get that

37:30

out of here because she's awesome

37:31

you know um

37:33

so so i'm very curious to see what what

37:35

she does or what her role may or may not

37:37

be in this new world order at chelsea um

37:42

what do you think about uh it like is

37:44

anybody safe right is tucle safe because

37:46

when i think about a new regime coming

37:48

in in any american sport and this is

37:50

sort of what we do a lot on the show we

37:51

basically say okay well over here this

37:54

is what would happen right and so uh if

37:56

a new general manager would have come in

37:57

or a new ownership or whatever uh i

37:59

think of college football a lot which is

38:01

sort of silly for you to think about but

38:03

um

38:04

uh if a new athletic director comes in

38:07

and they don't love the head coach they

38:08

give him like six months and like if you

38:10

don't win every game we have i have

38:12

every excuse in the world to get rid of

38:14

you if i want to tucle has quite a bit

38:16

of success in his short time at chelsea

38:18

but would you think that a new ownership

38:20

and new hierarchy in place might look to

38:23

potentially get rid of him

38:25

that's an interesting question um and i

38:28

think

38:29

it

38:30

will depend on how in tune the new

38:32

owners are with the fans right um and

38:35

this is where people like you know um

38:37

the chelsea supporters trust and things

38:39

like that are really important to be

38:40

able to communicate with the club about

38:43

what's good for them and what they want

38:45

and and um i think one key thing um it's

38:48

quite interesting chelsea fans disagree

38:50

about basically everything right you

38:52

can't get chelsea fans to agree on

38:54

literally anything except thomas tukle

38:57

everyone wants thomas tucker to stay

38:59

everyone thinks he's basically you know

39:01

if not one of if the best manager in the

39:03

world at the moment um and even you know

39:06

including myself

39:08

um uh you know i i would be absolutely

39:11

uh appalled at any decision to get rid

39:13

of um

39:14

what people are arguing is chelsea's

39:16

best manager ever you know in in

39:19

in a year you know

39:20

in really not a very long stretch of

39:22

time he's he's done what almost no other

39:25

manager has done you know i know you can

39:27

talk about dimateo in:

39:29

basically managed itself

39:32

you know uh with the champions league

39:34

whereas you know tuco did it and he

39:36

didn't re you know chelsea won the

39:38

champions league out of canter they

39:40

really did that their their defensive um

39:44

record of only letting in four goals the

39:46

entire campaign that was absolutely

39:47

ridiculous i'm not sure about you know

39:49

there's a good chance that might never

39:50

be broken again

39:52

and so um

39:54

tuko's legacy um and he's lucky um in a

39:58

sense to

39:59

for this to be the case but his legacy

40:01

is already cemented as like a great

40:03

chelsea coach um and i think that will

40:05

give um whoever the owner is to come in

40:08

like a good opportunity to to look at

40:10

him and figure out whether you know

40:12

they're who he's who they want to go

40:14

with for the future you know there's

40:15

there's not um there's precedent of of

40:19

uh of

40:21

managers staying um when new owners come

40:23

into the premier league and leaving um

40:25

for example you've got an example from

40:27

chelsea when roman abramovich came in

40:28

for the first time running area out

40:30

mourinho in right but then you've also

40:32

got an example of recently you've got um

40:35

burnley who were bought out by i think

40:37

it was um a lk's uh sports or something

40:40

like that they're alk

40:41

group

40:42

um

40:44

and um and they're still with sean dyche

40:46

because they love the guy um so there's

40:48

it's definitely about like how in tune

40:50

any new owner is with the club um and i

40:53

think

40:54

chelsea supporters more than anything

40:56

else with the new owner coming in they

40:58

want to stay

41:01

yeah i know that makes sense and i think

41:02

uh

41:03

i think it would be

41:05

a tremendous mistake to let him go i i

41:08

as you said with rival fans i hate

41:10

thomas twogle right so

41:12

so there you have it right um

41:14

although it looks like mourinho may be

41:16

out of a job again soon so if you did

41:18

want to go for another go around with

41:19

jose which i cannot stress i think would

41:22

be a great fit for chelsea at this point

41:24

um yeah no um well i mean i think that's

41:28

that's pretty much all i've got thank

41:29

you so much uh for coming on ollie uh

41:32

you can find ollie at ali j carpenter on

41:35

twitter and at goal lytics which we're

41:37

very excited to learn a little bit more

41:39

about and watch it grow uh just as much

41:41

as that thread did the other day thanks

41:43

so much ali for coming on that was the

41:45

squeaky bum time podcast with mike

41:47

salero and lauren corteans and sometimes

41:49

i like carpenter uh the football wing of

41:51

the chop sports network we record on

41:52

tuesdays and fridays so be sure to

41:54

subscribe wherever you get your podcast

41:56

so you never ever miss an episode and if

41:58

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41:59

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42:01

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42:03

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42:07

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42:08

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About the Podcast

Squeaky Bum Time: An English Premier League Podcast
We cover news from the Premier League, The FA Cup, Carabao Cup and the UEFA Champions League... as long as there are English clubs playing!
Laurent Courtines and Mike Salerno, two friends who love football and talk nonsense about things that make most people uncomfortable.

And sometimes Premier League football.

We focus on English football, talk about the clubs in the top flight, the relegation battle and how our beloved clubs Manchester City and Tottenham Hotspur are doing across all competition domestically and abroad.
Specifically, the Premier League, The FA Cup, Carabao Cup, UEFA Champions League, UEFA Europa League.
During internationals, we'll talk CONCACAF, UEFA, The United States National team, Mexico, Canada and the FIFA World Cup along with the European Championship.

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About your hosts

Laurent Courtines

Profile picture for Laurent Courtines
Laurent Courtines (co-host)- Since 1894, providing amateur, crap football punditry with a severe Manchester City bias. I don't hate your team, I just hate you.
I'm middle aged, I'm American, I never played football (or soccer for that matter) and I may not have actually watched your team play, but I'll talk about it anyway.

Mike Salerno

Profile picture for Mike Salerno
Co host of Squeaky Bum Time: A English Premier League Podcast with Mike Salerno and Laurent Courtines